In this roundtable, Lennix and Jay invited 0xMaki, Chef Maki & Core Contributor at Sushiswap – one of the most thrilling AMM projects in the DeFi space – to chat with us about scalability solutions, the MIRIN proposal, CeFi-DeFi integrations, and much more.
Key discussions in the roundtable include:
– MIRIN proposal
– Bitcoin & DeFi
– Scalability
– DeFi in one word
Transcripts:
00:00
[Music]
00:05
today we have uh
00:07
we have honor to have a two
00:08
distinguished guests
00:10
one is maki and uh the core contributor
00:13
from sushi swap
00:14
uh the other one is uh nxli
00:18
and uh director of financial market and
00:20
uh
00:21
from ok x and uh
00:25
could you guys uh give uh uh
00:28
give a brief introduction on um
00:31
uh your background and all that
00:35
sure do you do you want me to go ahead
00:37
the next yeah yeah
00:38
um so very very briefly very briefly
00:42
sushi swap is a community at amm
00:44
at the moment we’re developing ramping
00:47
up like new products at the same time
00:49
so we started as a fork of the very
00:50
popular uni swap
00:52
we were kind of frustrated by the fact
00:56
that you know the team was not receptive
00:58
to any
00:58
outsider contribution and so on so we
01:01
decided to roll with your own solution
01:03
which has been very successful so far
01:05
the market has speak it
01:06
spoke for itself and basically right now
01:09
we’re
01:09
working on the leverage uh and margin
01:12
platform called bento
01:13
uh it’s going to be uh released
01:17
this month hopefully after like all the
01:19
security tests are done
01:21
and then we’re working actively on the
01:23
miso which is kind of a sort of launch
01:25
pad for a new project
01:27
and so on so this is a
01:30
i would say the umbrella of product that
01:32
sushi is constantly expanding
01:34
and we’re also looking at like other um
01:36
layer one to expand onto
01:38
uh which are you know more traction and
01:40
so on so this is kind of
01:41
the intro for um for sushi swap for
01:43
myself very simple i’m just
01:45
a a simple core contributor someone that
01:47
loves the project
01:48
and i give myself every day to the
01:50
project yeah
01:52
okay that’s good that’s good uh linux
01:55
yeah
01:55
my uh my name is linux
01:59
i’m the director of okay x i’ve been
02:01
here for
02:03
like many years since okay x
02:06
day one so um i’m uh
02:10
i’m responsible for product tech or
02:13
and global business developments as well
02:15
right now currently
02:17
on the kdx so my background is a quant
02:20
traders
02:21
um i’ve been there working in
02:23
traditional financial fields
02:25
as i’ve traded in quants and compliance
02:27
for 10 years
02:29
so right now we are i’m embraced by
02:32
crypto
02:33
and build okay ux
02:36
okay very well very well and uh so
02:38
audience will uh definitely love you
02:40
guys
02:41
to join this uh session and i heard the
02:44
uh sushi swa
02:46
sushi swap had an incident and uh
02:49
maybe maki you can explain to our
02:51
audience that
02:52
what had happened what transpired and uh
02:55
yeah no problem
02:57
so i’ll go ahead very quickly uh so what
03:00
happened is
03:01
once we uh when we deploy very kind of
03:04
exotic pairs i would say
03:06
uh in the onsen and so on we need to set
03:09
up bridge
03:09
to make sure that you know um the smart
03:12
contract can be aware that this pair
03:14
cannot be traded for each
03:15
but should be traded for for example um
03:18
wbtc
03:19
or xyz asset and what happened
03:22
is the developers launched on sunday
03:26
uh very without you know kind of
03:28
deploying the bridge what happened is
03:30
there was
03:31
i think a hundred and fifty thousand
03:33
dollar worth of
03:35
dig token which is a new rebasing uh
03:37
asset from badger dow
03:39
which is supposed to follow the price of
03:42
um of bitcoin and what happened
03:44
is there was profit in there uh meaning
03:47
meant sorry meant to buy sushi on the
03:50
market the open market
03:52
instead uh someone that was you know
03:55
someone that saw the flaw i would say or
03:58
saw that we didn’t put the bridge on
04:00
uh was able to kind of do a small badger
04:04
a dig sorry a big eat pool and
04:06
basically like uh get all of the fun for
04:09
himself
04:10
so but this has been resolved you know i
04:12
think three hours after it was kind of
04:14
uncovered
04:15
uh it’s quite unfortunate but at the
04:17
same time you know these
04:18
uh these funds were not uh were profit
04:21
meant to buy sushi on the market so no
04:24
one lost any funds and so on we were um
04:26
it was resolved and from now on you know
04:29
there’s kind of an
04:30
automated process to deploy new new pair
04:32
on the onsen to make sure
04:34
we have all the bridge set up okay
04:37
uh so i’m glad to hear that uh it’s been
04:40
solved very swiftly and uh
04:42
everything has
04:46
it’s no hiccup anymore and uh so let’s
04:49
uh move on
04:50
sushi i heard sushi join forces with the
04:53
year in finance last december
04:55
so what does the urine and sushi swap
04:58
collaboration mean for the whole team
05:00
for both teams and also as d5 as a whole
05:04
and any any change
05:07
on the decision making and the
05:09
development and
05:10
so from you guys um
05:13
marky you want to go ahead yeah sure so
05:16
it’s very simple i mean you we get in
05:19
this in a room
05:20
a bunch of people that are breeding and
05:24
kind of passionate with this whole like
05:26
d5 ecosystem
05:27
and we make them collaborate to empower
05:30
each other and make sure that you know
05:31
we can elevate the whole ecosystem with
05:33
us
05:33
so you can see like um you know this
05:37
past week the past week we saw yearn
05:39
use uh their old
05:42
allocation point to boost the liquidity
05:45
of one of their
05:46
um their vault the yv
05:49
crv which was um called the back
05:53
scratcher one
05:54
it is a very interesting product because
05:56
the crv that you put in this pool are
05:59
luck forever
06:00
but in exchange you get yield and um in
06:03
three in tree ac i i don’t remember the
06:07
exact name but it’s like basically like
06:09
a usd
06:10
um dollar form from curve
06:13
and what is interesting with this
06:16
product is it was lacking a lot of
06:17
liquidity nobody wanted to put
06:20
crv into it because the rewards were not
06:22
high enough
06:23
and you know like yarn couldn’t
06:25
incentivize it properly and so on and so
06:27
on
06:27
but what is key to this pool is that
06:30
once it is
06:31
with deep liquidity all of the other
06:33
pools from yarn
06:34
profit from uh this kind of voting boost
06:39
so what happened is they used all of
06:41
their allocation points they were able
06:43
to
06:44
make the liquidity go up to i think 10
06:46
million dollar at the moment
06:48
and that boosted the yield from all of
06:50
the other urine pools so that was kind
06:52
of
06:53
very amazing to see another
06:56
collaboration very
06:57
briefly is the way that cover is now
07:00
going to be
07:00
enabled to all of the urine pools um
07:03
moving forward so you know this is the
07:06
sort of
07:07
collaboration that you wouldn’t be able
07:08
to see if we were not
07:10
part of uh the same ecosystem i would
07:12
say or you know working
07:14
all in touch with each other
07:17
right right uh nina’s your character
07:19
weighing on this
07:21
yeah i think i think i i love the fact
07:24
that she
07:25
is one of the more decentralized
07:28
protocol
07:28
i mean truly decentralized that
07:30
community driven
07:32
decks uh uh that we ever seen
07:35
comparing other um protocols so
07:38
that give us a thought on being
07:41
one of the major cex in the world
07:44
because we are we love the idea the
07:47
notion of decentralization and
07:50
one of our purpose of existence is to
07:52
try and decentralize ourselves
07:55
the matter from organization perspective
07:58
and also product perspective
08:00
so i think i think i do think that
08:04
some of the components can decentralize
08:07
gradually um on some of the features
08:10
components that we can design have
08:12
decentralized gradually so
08:14
uh i just quit right compounds that
08:16
we’re talking about am
08:17
that whether we can whether we can
08:20
execute
08:21
ammo to in there coupled with a hybrid
08:24
between a
08:25
m and all the book mechanism there’s
08:27
something that’s really worth to explore
08:29
the
08:30
together with the team in sushi and also
08:33
we have a lot of bank
08:34
in cx for example like ky’s component
08:38
for example like a
08:39
insurance fund uh tokenize the insurance
08:41
fund
08:42
a lot of things that we are we are
08:45
looking
08:45
to uh being while in the progress of
08:49
decentralization we need
08:51
or we we can collaborate with our data
08:54
we collaborate with our users
08:55
so they can build cool code with sushi
08:57
teams
09:01
very good very good and i think uh i
09:03
definitely see uh this
09:05
uh collaboration will bring a lot of uh
09:08
uh to the future the bright future and
09:12
it comes to the fruition uh in the end
09:16
and i hope that it works out for both on
09:18
both parties
09:19
and uh also um what’s a future plan for
09:24
for sushi swap uh this year 2021.
09:27
uh you care to uh uh let’s elaborate a
09:31
little bit
09:31
uh maki sure so
09:34
i mean the road map is available on
09:36
medium i do think that you know i won’t
09:38
be uh talking about the whole road map
09:40
here because it could go
09:42
for uh more than 30 minutes just by
09:44
itself
09:45
but one of the most interesting thing um
09:48
that we
09:48
saw a lot of people talk about is mirin
09:51
which is going to be
09:52
sort of our franchise pull model for um
09:54
bringing
09:55
or bridging i would say um centralized
09:58
exchange with you know the d5 world a
10:00
little bit more
10:01
and what is very interesting on this
10:03
part is
10:05
you know for example if we take the if
10:07
we take ok x as an example here
10:09
uh a collaboration idea that could be
10:12
possible is
10:13
i don’t think you know everyone needs to
10:15
trade on
10:16
d5 at the moment it is not sustainable i
10:19
think
10:19
it is very clear that you know some
10:21
people are priced out with all of the
10:23
fees uh the gas price and so on rising
10:25
because of
10:26
of usage so the trading the
10:29
the best feeding venue at the moment is
10:31
certainly a centralized exchange
10:33
for sure 100 okay like with the graphics
10:36
uh with the order books and so on and so
10:38
on but
10:39
there’s like something to to understand
10:41
here i think
10:42
um running a decentralized exchange is
10:46
like very cheap at the moment and
10:49
the thing is if you are a lp in a pool
10:52
you don’t need to be awake
10:54
for while doing the trade right you can
10:56
just put the asset there
10:58
and just leave it there they will be
11:00
earning fees they will be earning
11:02
uh all of this kind of arbitrage that is
11:05
going on at the moment between the
11:06
centralized and decentralized world
11:08
and what is very interesting is we’ve
11:10
been developing even like a solution to
11:15
alleviate impermanent loss that has been
11:18
very successful so far in the testing
11:20
from andre
11:22
meaning that you know like while the
11:24
people are not trading actively trading
11:26
their asset
11:27
on any platform they can provide them as
11:30
uh they can provide them as liquidity on
11:33
defy on this
11:34
decentralized exchange that can still be
11:36
traded 24 7
11:38
without any downtime and so on and so on
11:41
and i think this is where
11:42
it shines and what is interesting with
11:44
this model with mirin
11:45
is that we make it so that the
11:47
parameters can be tweaked
11:49
by the exchange so they can earn while
11:52
their assets are being
11:53
kind of deployed on the blockchain and
11:56
this is very interesting because we are
11:58
starting to see not only a win-win
12:00
situation for the exchange and for
12:02
the death center as well but we are
12:04
seeing a win-win-win
12:05
so for the customer he can make his
12:07
asset productive
12:09
while he’s sleeping while he’s not
12:10
actively trading because the truth is
12:13
most of the majority of retail needs to
12:16
be working
12:17
eight hours a day they need to be
12:18
sleeping you know
12:20
during d5 summer that was four hour but
12:22
now you know with normal life
12:24
i would say maybe eight or six um so in
12:27
the meantime they can’t be trading and
12:28
if someone cannot be trading that means
12:30
the centralized exchange is not
12:32
producing any fees uh which is
12:34
detrimental to them
12:36
and i do think that you know such as a
12:38
tight collaboration can be beneficial to
12:40
everyone
12:41
and these assets being deployed on d5
12:44
makes the price
12:45
uh more liquid makes the asset uh
12:47
flowing and so on
12:49
i’m not saying that you know distance
12:50
rise exchange is the key to everything
12:53
and especially not with the gas fee at
12:54
the moment but i do think that in the
12:57
future we can see like a d fighting like
12:59
a hundred billion dollar
13:01
under tvl with you know these kind of
13:03
collaboration
13:04
um there’s still articles but we’d love
13:07
to to hear linux
13:08
about this yep uh yeah
13:12
uh we uh we particularly exciting of
13:16
this
13:17
proposal integration because um on
13:20
nokia’s perspective we already
13:22
have a product called earned what earn
13:26
does this basically allow
13:27
our customer to put their idle cash or
13:30
idle token
13:32
to earn you with one click
13:36
uh in various protocols and we see the
13:39
data
13:40
now we see sushi is one of the top
13:44
picked selected poor
13:48
to be um due to for our customer to
13:51
to stick their liquidity on there so
13:54
what we need to do is basically quite
13:56
simple is to seamlessly
13:58
uh upgrade on the back on behind
14:02
so the customer doesn’t really need to
14:04
clear a lot of things just one click
14:06
right but we need to add all kinds of
14:09
poor
14:10
that allow sushi to provide and
14:13
and on our back and directly contribute
14:16
to the
14:17
to the exchange back to uh
14:21
liquidity poor so that on ok excite we
14:24
already
14:24
have at least a big part of it
14:28
on product sign so i think
14:31
the next step is going to be very
14:33
exciting that if
14:35
if we just need to do some treats
14:38
to integrate directly with mirin
14:40
political about exchange back token so
14:44
so that our billions of access that’s
14:47
currently
14:48
idle for a customer can earn a passive
14:51
yield
14:52
contributed by sushi um i’m not sure
14:56
whether we will issue
14:58
a okay specific lp token for that
15:02
but i will definitely consider this
15:04
proposal very interesting
15:06
that because this gave us a lot of
15:07
freedom because we can twist power
15:10
parameters behind
15:13
yeah i think with the marine comes up
15:16
and uh
15:17
all the uh see the further integration
15:19
with the okay x
15:20
and uh it’s a uh it’s
15:24
it’s i think i would say it’s a very
15:26
clear the collaboration between
15:28
sushi and and okay ex and uh
15:31
now uh one of the core arguments uh in
15:34
d5 is uh
15:36
how do we extend the uh bitcoin
15:38
community to the uh
15:41
to the uh to the uh the crypto world
15:44
and uh uh and especially the
15:47
with the institutional player locking
15:49
into the uh
15:51
uh the most valuable assets according
15:53
bitcoin
15:54
and so we we want to say and the bitcoin
15:57
holders to the
15:59
how would they participate in the d5
16:02
space
16:02
so what do you guys think and how would
16:04
you um
16:06
how should we migrate the bitcoin into
16:09
into the
16:10
uh into the d5 bitcoin community into
16:12
the d5
16:13
uh linux you want to start with that
16:17
yeah i think there’s obviously a lot of
16:19
solutions already
16:21
for a raptor exact in red cone that can
16:24
potentially uh
16:25
uh to contribute define
16:28
uh yeah i agree the the question that
16:31
most of the xx right now in crypto is
16:34
being locked
16:36
or purely on
16:39
on on bitcoin
16:42
uh i think bitcoin is like more like a
16:45
parking fund right now for entering or
16:47
accessing the
16:48
vast majority community on crypto so you
16:51
can see that
16:52
uh when bitcoin there is total
16:55
money deposit and stake in in bitcoin
16:58
right now you can see that the money
17:00
flow is gradually moving
17:03
to the other non-bitcoin crypto for
17:05
example like ethereum more order d5
17:08
or device space so i don’t particularly
17:11
worry that the bitcoin holder do not
17:13
have the intention to contribute on
17:15
define
17:16
but i agree that um maybe walking
17:20
btc is not a perfect solution because
17:22
you need is not completely decentralized
17:25
so i think the industry can work on a
17:27
technical or more technical
17:29
purely blockchain on chain solution for
17:32
for bitcoin community or protocol get
17:35
directly
17:36
not to stick and one smart contract on
17:38
defined space
17:42
okay uh that’s pretty good um mark key
17:44
you
17:45
of waiting on this as well
17:48
i mean to be honest with you jay and
17:51
linux
17:52
i’ve been observing like the bitcoin
17:54
crowd for quite some time already like
17:56
i would say yeah a few years yeah and
17:59
they are like a very uh strange crowd
18:02
because
18:03
they are you know like the most
18:05
proponent of decentralization and so on
18:07
but then you see how they use their
18:09
bitcoin they always send them on the
18:11
chance to trade them
18:12
centralized exchange they always if they
18:14
claim that they will be doing d5 then
18:16
they will be sending them
18:17
on something like um block fee or you
18:20
know
18:20
uh celsius or whatever that is still
18:22
again centralized
18:24
yeah don’t i don’t get it but then they
18:26
don’t want to
18:27
wrap their asset into another chain to
18:30
then actually leverage all of the
18:32
quote unquote decentralized um
18:35
protocol that could potentially like you
18:37
know enable them to
18:39
have yield on their assets you know like
18:41
and so on like even like
18:42
i would say pro bitcoin um protocol like
18:46
badger down or um things like that you
18:49
know
18:50
where you are basically like a
18:52
first-class citizen if you own bitcoin
18:54
there because that’s their goal to make
18:56
sure that bitcoiner can
18:57
yield um like
19:01
with their assets you know without you
19:02
know buying heat or so on
19:04
but the thing is it is quite hard for
19:06
them i think to grasp it you know like
19:08
to use metamask or
19:10
uh understand like the gas pricing and
19:12
so on like
19:13
it is so uh alien to them that
19:16
they are not able to or they give up i
19:18
think they give up very easily
19:20
and once like if unless we have
19:23
something that is
19:24
very familiar to them uh very bitcoin
19:27
like
19:28
i don’t think we’re going to see a
19:31
bitcoin you know bridging through
19:32
d5 especially on ethereum anytime soon
19:35
it is not
19:36
quote unquote friendly enough in my
19:38
opinion yet
19:39
for someone that is you know a diary
19:42
tyrion or someone that
19:43
is a crypto native it’s
19:46
it’s easy or okay i would say but yet
19:49
it’s not perfect like i what i like to
19:52
say to bitcoiner
19:53
is give it a try send them on randy tcc
19:58
on boringdale obtc or um
20:02
on keep network with tbtc make them wrap
20:06
their bitcoin
20:07
and then see if they can interact with
20:09
you know something very easy like
20:11
compound or have a something
20:15
that is very risk-free
20:18
but just that it’s like so much steps
20:20
for them that they give up and
20:22
they prefer to just and there’s a
20:24
there’s this problem also in the culture
20:26
with bitcoiners
20:27
it’s the other right the other mentality
20:29
where yeah you just you
20:31
you buy your bitcoin and you keep them
20:33
you’re not like
20:34
uh similar to ethereum where everyone is
20:36
productivizing their assets right now
20:38
if you have ethereum or if you have dye
20:41
or if you have uh usdc
20:43
or wi-fi sushi and they’re like staying
20:47
idle in your wallet you’re leaving like
20:50
money on the table at the moment
20:51
it makes no sense because all of the the
20:54
network or ecosystem is designed for you
20:56
to have yield at the moment
20:58
it is something that has been there
21:00
since summer uh
21:01
i don’t think it’s going to go anywhere
21:04
away
21:04
and that is where you know like
21:06
quote-unquote centralized solution makes
21:08
more sense for bitcoin where
21:10
they don’t need to understand about gas
21:12
they can just go
21:13
uh and provide there but it’s quite sad
21:16
that you know
21:17
they’re left behind everything i think
21:20
yeah i think they they
21:22
gradually manage this and you can think
21:24
bitcoin is like the mass market right
21:26
that
21:26
it’s not they’re not crypto natives
21:28
that’s you guys so
21:30
so maybe the industry like central
21:32
exchange can do a little bit more
21:34
improvement on the beaches that for them
21:37
will be corners to hold but going to
21:40
contribute divine interacting
21:43
but you’re right it’s a different
21:45
community very different right now
21:50
yeah i i definitely agree with the both
21:52
of you and i
21:54
i think i think uh let’s lead to
21:57
the next question which is a kind of
21:59
relate to this one
22:00
and basically with the all those d5 hype
22:04
and all that
22:05
and uh that places a lot of weight on
22:08
the
22:08
ethereum’s shorter and so people are
22:11
exploring layered two solutions and
22:13
other infrastructure
22:15
and uh considering um some solution
22:18
for for this and for the current device
22:22
of stability and all that
22:24
so any thoughts on this linux anyone
22:27
uh waiting on this first or maybe monkey
22:30
is better
22:31
better of course
22:34
marquee no no go go for it please go for
22:37
it i know i’d love to hear more and i
22:39
can just like close
22:40
uh very swiftly with a few thoughts
22:42
we’ve been exploring them so
22:44
please go ahead um
22:48
yeah in my opinion it’s like there’s a
22:51
lot of
22:51
solutions on potential solution for
22:56
scalability on ethereum i’m not
22:58
particular and
22:59
an expert on everything but for the but
23:03
um in a nutshell so my gut feeling that
23:07
uh there’s a lot of obvious exciting
23:09
solutions
23:10
right look at the occlusions layer two
23:12
solution that
23:14
i think uh for the size of sushi
23:17
if i really talk to community i think i
23:20
would pick
23:20
a relatively conservative approach to
23:23
scale
23:25
because this would is already given the
23:27
size of the community already and the
23:29
trading volume is already there
23:31
and an amm display is pitfall is already
23:35
working it’s still working and and i’m
23:38
i’m very sure that would be an
23:40
improvement on the apple reform of amm
23:43
so uh maybe we don’t need to have a
23:47
really drastic change
23:48
on unscathed here at the moment but
23:50
rather a relatively safe and sound
23:52
approach
23:55
that’s that’s a very good answer because
23:57
i do think you kind of
23:58
pinpoint one of the the main thing here
24:01
is
24:02
it is working even with you know the
24:04
drastic cuffs of guests at the moment
24:07
and why is it working it’s because um
24:10
well
24:11
arbitrager and so on don’t care about
24:13
these fees because they’re moving
24:15
so much that it’s not affecting them
24:18
it’s kind of deplorable
24:19
for you know like the kind of retail
24:21
users and you know smarter uh crypto
24:23
holders and i totally agree with this
24:25
but compostability is very difficult to
24:29
um to move on on a layer to um
24:33
layer because if you only move the emm
24:36
component
24:37
then you’re on there too where you know
24:39
swapping asset
24:40
is is cheap but what else can you do
24:43
like if you can only swap there’s like
24:45
absolutely no um benefits in my opinion
24:48
the benefits is when you have access to
24:50
a money market when you have amm when
24:53
you have
24:54
insurance when you have yield aggregator
24:56
when you have strategies
24:58
to leverage uh options derivative and so
25:01
on like
25:02
this is what is the fun about ethereum
25:04
it’s the fact that there is so much to
25:06
do not that you can just
25:08
um go somewhere else and do some swap
25:10
for cheap
25:11
this is not how it worked and that’s why
25:14
i do think
25:15
if we see layer two coming up and by the
25:18
way uh
25:19
at the moment what i feel very funny
25:21
about all these layer two talks that you
25:24
know
25:24
i’ve been having and research is it
25:26
feels like in 2017 when people were
25:29
saying
25:29
lightning is coming for bitcoin i don’t
25:31
know if you remember that yeah
25:32
yeah yeah like when when you know the
25:36
transaction fees for bitcoin were so
25:38
high oh lightning is coming don’t worry
25:40
don’t worry
25:40
and then we never saw it coming you know
25:43
i don’t think it’s gonna happen for
25:44
ethereum but still like uh
25:45
this is what it reminds me yeah i think
25:48
personally we’re gonna be seeing like
25:50
breakthrough in like three to six months
25:52
hopefully if we don’t you know this is
25:54
only gonna accelerate kind of
25:56
um the paths to a side chain
26:00
like you know x-zymatic uh which are not
26:03
you know like completely secure like
26:05
they’re
26:05
too but you know are potentially like uh
26:08
attractive for another set of users
26:11
that’s why we’re seeing like right now
26:13
a lot of excitement around other layer
26:15
one personally i’m not like a huge fan
26:18
of them
26:18
but i do i do think that if there’s a
26:20
community
26:22
in other layer one then i don’t see why
26:24
you wouldn’t be opening
26:25
a facility or restaurant or you know
26:27
outpost of sushi swap
26:29
i think we’re very like open-minded
26:31
towards like all of these kind of
26:33
other chains as long as they are not
26:35
kind of pressuring us to move the
26:37
liquidity that is already on ethereum
26:39
and want to stay there
26:41
uh this is a very key to our approach
26:44
and then like you said like we don’t
26:47
need to rush anything
26:48
uh aside aside from making it like
26:52
very good once it once it’s released and
26:54
the thing is what is very great about
26:56
sushi swap is that we’re part of an
26:57
ecosystem we’re power of yarn
26:59
if we move somewhere we’re going to be
27:01
moving in sync with all of our partners
27:03
meaning that we’re going to have cream
27:05
finance moving with us we’re gonna have
27:07
uh urine we’re gonna have um cover
27:10
we’re gonna have pickle and so on like
27:12
acropolis
27:14
uh cd cvp and so on like this is what is
27:17
very powerful about like you know having
27:19
kind of this community of projects
27:21
helping each other and the thing is once
27:24
we see the
27:26
the first movers going somewhere i think
27:28
everyone is going to move there
27:30
it doesn’t matter if there’s like a two
27:32
or three nights project somewhere
27:34
else if everyone is having fun a party
27:36
in one house
27:37
everyone is gonna go there that’s how it
27:39
works and i think
27:41
there’s a lot of people are just waiting
27:42
for this inflection moment
27:44
once you know the tech is gonna be ready
27:46
the duck is going to be ready
27:48
and then you won’t even see it then
27:52
it’s going to happen yeah uh i
27:55
i definitely see in the future maybe you
27:58
know in about half a year or so
28:00
there’s another chain coming in a layer
28:02
one solution and they offer many layers
28:04
and uh so that that could be a very
28:07
good uh option for for all those people
28:11
they’re they’re uh worried about the uh
28:14
uh
28:15
the gas feeds and all that uh the infi
28:17
in efficiency and all that
28:19
the speed and the transaction speed and
28:21
all that and uh
28:23
the new chain i definitely i see that
28:24
it’s coming and uh
28:26
so and i hope uh sushi and other uh
28:30
dap or d5 projects they’re waiting to
28:33
jump on that
28:34
and uh so um yeah uh
28:37
there are a lot of things it’s happening
28:38
so quick with the crypto space and
28:41
uh yeah that’s uh i think i think that’s
28:43
a coming
28:44
and also and lastly and i want to ask
28:47
you
28:48
uh do you guys have any uh come up with
28:51
a word to describe
28:52
the uh about the
28:56
the future and also the uh the future of
28:58
d5 and why
29:01
marquee won’t go first
29:07
sure i think my word would be
29:09
unstoppable
29:10
so you can’t stop it you cannot shut it
29:12
down you cannot
29:14
um it is for everyone and globally so i
29:17
do think that unstoppable would be my
29:19
word for
29:20
the future of d5 and it’s going to be
29:22
ramping up
29:23
so fast this year i’m already quite
29:25
excited
29:27
okay that’s very good word uh
29:30
my work would be exponential
29:33
very very exponential so i think once
29:36
the divine
29:37
solving all the crypto road
29:39
block and heat critical mass
29:42
is unstoppable and going to be
29:44
exponential so because its permission is
29:47
nature and there is a
29:50
relatively less barrier of entry um
29:54
so we can see maybe in the very short
29:57
term that we hit 10 flow
29:58
of users and tbm in very short term
30:04
okay unstoppable and unexplainable those
30:07
uh
30:08
uh it’s like a big transformer come in
30:11
and uh it’s just uh
30:12
explodes well thank you guys for coming
30:15
in and uh
30:16
jay i would like to i would like to hear
30:18
your word about d5 what do you think the
30:20
future of d5 is going to be
30:22
well d5 i i don’t think d5 will take off
30:25
i know all fours
30:26
it’s taken for a year now and almost a
30:28
year
30:29
and uh the future is uh because of d5
30:32
it’s more like
30:33
the the only the only way i see is uh
30:37
the dax it’s very good dax is very
30:39
unique and it
30:40
adopts the emm and there could be more
30:42
methods more
30:44
different algorithm can be used and also
30:46
for the banking system
30:48
that’s a it’s a good revolutionize the
30:50
entire
30:51
traditional banking industry and uh
30:55
so all of this have uh have a different
30:58
edges but i think in the end and
31:01
they need to uh uh they need to combine
31:04
with the real world
31:05
assets okay like uh um
31:10
like real estate or some real world
31:12
assets uh
31:13
sto and all that and uh so all of this
31:16
could be coming to uh uh we’re in sync
31:19
and i’m gonna play and uh so while
31:22
everybody is on the same page
31:24
they know what they’re doing and uh so
31:26
the d5 definitely will be
31:27
very big i don’t think it will go away
31:29
uh it will just uh
31:31
only going growing um i won’t say
31:34
exponentially but it definitely we’re
31:36
going very big
31:37
very big but um um like i couldn’t
31:40
stress enough the real world
31:42
assets it’s definitely comes to play a
31:44
big part of it
31:48
i would like to add a little bit on okay
31:52
perspective that uh we think
31:55
in general that define would be much
31:58
bigger than c5
32:00
on there and we are willing to play part
32:02
of it
32:03
and and we think we think that
32:07
all this define will be playing a
32:09
relatively small part
32:11
but we still can be i think c5
32:15
can be a very very core component within
32:18
this space because it’s like a bridges
32:20
between traditional finance and retail
32:23
customers
32:25
so it looks like that um cfi will
32:28
eventually connect it
32:30
it will be working like broker for all
32:32
kinds of
32:33
liquidity venue on all or
32:36
liquidity poor exchanges
32:40
behind order all the protocol
32:44
yeah i totally agree with you um yeah
32:48
uh i i think yeah it’s a it’s a c fight
32:50
it’s definitely it’s a bridge between
32:53
uh the real world and
32:56
also the d5 and it’s like they’re
32:58
they’re like a couple they
32:59
they just couldn’t live without each
33:01
other but d5 uh this
33:03
d5 definitely would i like i said i
33:06
definitely would be big
33:07
will be big and much bigger than this
33:09
right now
33:10
that’s just the beginning
33:16
maki any any more questions
33:21
no i think that kind of wraps it up but
33:23
i’m very happy to see that
33:25
you guys are actually like on the
33:27
cutting edge and you know like kind of
33:28
uh open-minded to all of this new like
33:31
industry i feel like
33:32
we’re on a cusp of something like
33:35
literally like so big that you know we
33:37
can’t even imagine remotely
33:39
how far it’s gonna go like i like to
33:41
tell people like
33:42
imagine how many banks there is in the
33:44
world can you even imagine
33:46
like count them like just by country
33:48
there’s like more than you can
33:50
imagine sometimes like imagine when all
33:53
of this
33:54
i would say capital and wealth is going
33:55
to be
33:57
unchained and you know like global it’s
33:59
just going to be insane in my opinion
34:01
and that’s where we are headed like it
34:04
doesn’t make any sense that we’re not
34:06
already at 100 billion dollar in my
34:08
opinion but it’s
34:09
all about making these bridges more
34:12
friendly more efficient
34:13
less scary uh no rockford
34:16
and so on like it’s all about kind of
34:19
this aspect to make sure that the future
34:20
of finance
34:22
come to you know um to happen
34:25
and i think it’s just a matter of time
34:27
it’s not a matter of uh
34:28
if so we’re past this threshold in the
34:31
opinion
34:32
but super happy to uh to have been here
34:35
thank you jay thank you linux
34:36
thank you a very good thought you’re
34:38
welcome
34:40
thank you so much okay bye everyone bye
34:44
[Music]
34:46
bye
34:48
[Music]
34:56
you
